Talk:Ferdinand Habsburg (racing driver)

This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Ferdinand Habsburg (racing driver) article.
This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject.

Put new text under old text. Click here to start a new topic.
New to Wikipedia? Welcome! Learn to edit; get help.

Article policies

Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL

This article must adhere to the biographies of living persons (BLP) policy, even if it is not a biography, because it contains material about living persons. Contentious material about living persons that is unsourced or poorly sourced must be removed immediately from the article and its talk page, especially if potentially libellous. If such material is repeatedly inserted, or if you have other concerns, please report the issue to this noticeboard.

If you are a subject of this article, or acting on behalf of one, and you need help, please see this help page.

Biography: Royalty and Nobility

	Biography portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Biography, a collaborative effort to create, develop and organize Wikipedia's articles about people. All interested editors are invited to join the project and contribute to the discussion. For instructions on how to use this banner, please refer to the documentation.BiographyWikipedia:WikiProject BiographyTemplate:WikiProject Biographybiography articles
	This article is supported by WikiProject Royalty and Nobility (assessed as Low-importance).

Austria Low‑importance

	Austria portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Austria, an attempt to build a comprehensive and detailed guide to articles about Austria on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please join the project.AustriaWikipedia:WikiProject AustriaTemplate:WikiProject AustriaAustria articles
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

Hungary Low‑importance

	Hungary portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Hungary, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Hungary on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.HungaryWikipedia:WikiProject HungaryTemplate:WikiProject HungaryHungary articles
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

Motorsport Low‑importance

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject Motorsport, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Motorsport on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.MotorsportWikipedia:WikiProject MotorsportTemplate:WikiProject Motorsportmotorsport articles
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

Former countries: Austria-Hungary

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject Former countries, a collaborative effort to improve Wikipedia's coverage of defunct states and territories (and their subdivisions). If you would like to participate, please join the project.Former countriesWikipedia:WikiProject Former countriesTemplate:WikiProject Former countriesformer country articles
	This article is supported by the Austria-Hungary task force.

The name of this article

Should be the Archduke Ferdinand Zvonimir of Austria. I belive that the other user misinterpreted in his desire not to include the name Zvonimir. This name is very interesting, not to be mentioned in the article. Then the user who wants the name Zvonimir out of the title added (b. 1997) to make it different from the other Archdukes named Ferdinand of Austria. This was not a good move. -- Imbris (talk) 18:43, 18 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Requested move

The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was moved. Wizardman 21:45, 30 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Archduke Ferdinand Zvonimir of Austria (born 1997) → Archduke Ferdinand Zvonimir of Austria — Per above, the parenthetical birth date is the result of old moves and is not needed for disambiguation purposes. ~~Neither is the qualifier "of Austria" - he is the only Archduke Ferdinand Zvonimir around.~~ Never mind about the second part, it seems including the "of Austria" conforms to current conventions. --Llakais 13:17, 23 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Support per above Surtsicna (talk) 20:35, 29 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

Dear admin, What's the reason of re-ordering the article? That so called "intro" is WAY TOO MUCH! It should look like this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jamie_Campbell-Walter Short lead about him as a racing driver, and the long, historical info in a section called Family... — Preceding unsigned comment added by Keiju 91 (talk • contribs) 18:33, 26 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Title

Why is his title "Archduke of Austria, Royal Prince of Hungary, Bohemia and Croatia" when he's not recognized in any of this countries? --93.143.133.37 (talk) 10:58, 8 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Well, because he is born with these titles. The titles derives from his family/ancestors - the titles themselves are not dependent on whether one particular state 'recognizes' these titles or not, that's how the system works with such royal titles inherited from your family. Oleryhlolsson (talk) 14:37, 8 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Requested move 1 May 2021

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: Moved - clear consensus to move with basis in the WP:MIDDLENAME guideline and agreement with the proposed title over the unparenthesised one.(non-admin closure) FOARP (talk) 19:19, 15 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Ferdinand Zvonimir von Habsburg → Ferdinand Habsburg (racing driver) – The subject is 2021 Asian Le Mans Series champion. He also happens to be descended from the former royal family of Austria-Hungary (which was dissolved decades before he was born). It is clear from the balance of weight in this article that his motor racing career gives rise to greater notability than his ancestry.

This proposal also reflects the subject's apparent preference and the preponderance of sources. In his professional life, the subject exclusively uses the name Ferdinand Habsburg (see e.g. [1] [2]). This name is also standard in the relevant press (e.g. [3] [4] [5] [6] [7]). By contrast, the name Ferdinand Zvonimir von Habsburg is little used outside Wikipedia and is not used by the subject himself. Kahastok talk 12:37, 1 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Worth adding that we do have policy that backs this. WP:MIDDLENAME says use the most common format of a name used in reliable sources: if that is with a middle name or initials, make the Wikipedia article title conform to that format. In this case, the most common format does not include a middle name or initial, or a von, and so we should not include them either. Kahastok talk 12:43, 1 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Support per nom.--Ortizesp (talk) 16:51, 1 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Support, but let us consider a move to Ferdinand Habsburg instead. No-one else can be correctly referred to as Ferdinand Habsburg. He also appears to be the primary meaning of "Ferdinand Habsburg" on Google (though not on Google Books, of course). Surtsicna (talk) 18:11, 1 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I've no objection to calling it Ferdinand Habsburg. I proposed the disambiguator mostly because Ferdinand Habsburg already exists as a dab page and I am not certain enough of the history to be sure whether this individual is the WP:PRIMARYTOPIC. Kahastok talk 18:31, 1 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I strong oppose "Ferdinand Habsburg". Google result in this regard is misleading, obviously the other Ferdinands more frequently appear in academic sources, including "traditional paper" books and volumes. A second-tier race car driver, who competes in lower class races, definitely no better known person than a Holy Roman emperor. --Norden1990 (talk) 19:54, 2 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Of course other Ferdinands are more notable. It is just that it would be incorrect to call any of the emperors "Ferdinand Habsburg". The emperors would instead be Ferdinand of Habsburg (Ferdinand von Habsburg). This may or may not be enough to drop the parenthetical disambiguation. Surtsicna (talk) 20:30, 2 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Support "Ferdinand Habsburg (racing driver)" per nom. Oppose "Ferdinand Habsburg" per Norden1990. Disagree with Surtsicna that a Google search proves the racing driver is the primary topic. Ferdinand I, Holy Roman Emperor alone has 60% more page views with 24,000+ this month; all others (including this page) have 12,000-16,000 each. While it might be incorrect to title any of the emperors' pages as "Ferdinand Habsburg," it would be appropriate to use that name as a search term when looking for the emperors and we should expect that some users will do so. No clear primary topic - Ferdinand Habsburd should continue to redirect to the DAB. Combefere ❯❯❯ Talk 03:55, 3 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Support move to Ferdinand Habsburg (racing driver) per all above. Oppose move to Ferdinand Habsburg. That last is just the sort of technical mistake a reader or editor might make when looking for one of the historical figures, all of whom were of very considerable importance; and bad bluelinks are very difficult to find and fix. Narky Blert (talk) 14:19, 13 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Honors

List of memberships in various orders. 2603:6000:DC00:7A92:A944:63BC:6DFF:E41F (talk) 00:39, 28 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Why did someone remove that he is a Knight of the Austrian Order of the Golden Fleece? Membership is apparently a huge big deal, and socially (in Europe, at least), he could be the world's best F1 driver, but that still would not place him in the same social class as a member of this order. 2603:6000:DC00:7A92:A944:63BC:6DFF:E41F (talk) 00:42, 28 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

NY Times article

This may be of interest to anyone who works on this article. -Ad Orientem (talk) 01:06, 7 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]