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Talk:Med Jets Flight 056

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Med Jets on behalf of Jet Rescue Air Ambulance ???

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I could not find any source for that information from the infobox (no, there is none in the quoted source https://bnonews.com/index.php/2025/01/plane-crashes-in-philadelphia-6-dead/, it was edited later without explanations by Air Astana 1388 (talk · contribs) on https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Med_Jets_Flight_056&diff=prev&oldid=1273196725, who subsequently edited the page to read "operated by Med Jets SA de CV on behalf of Jet Rescue Air Ambulance as Med Jets Flight 56"). Neither in the page nor in a Google search outside wikipedia.

Rather, it seems that Jet Rescue Air Ambulance is the commercial brand of Med Jets, S.A. de C.V. - see https://otc-cta.gc.ca/eng/enforcement-action/med-jets-sa-cv-carrying-business-jet-rescue-air-ambulance.

No source either for any "Med Jets Flight 056". Except that ADS-B tracking sites refer to it under "MTS56" or "Med Jets 56" which would be the radio and flight plan callsign - cf https://www.flightaware.com/live/flight/MTS56 - though in the infobox it says that call sign is "MED SERVICE 056" or "MEDEVAC MED SERVICE 056", depending of the history versions... and https://123atc.com/call-sign/MTS says it is MEDSERVICE

This makes the current title even more problematic (see above Talk:Med Jets Flight 056#Med Jets Flight 056) - Df (talk) 00:30, 4 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Med Jets seems to operate the Mexican registry aircraft, while Century Aviation operates U.S. registry aircraft under the banner of Jet Rescue? Or so says the Jet Rescue website. It's Canadian license does say "Med Jets, S.A. de C.V. carrying on business as Jet Rescue Air Ambulance" [1]; and the U.S. government says "Med Jets S.A. de C.V. (d/b/a Jet Rescue Air Ambulance)" [2] -- 65.92.246.77 (talk) 04:35, 6 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Title

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The ADS-B ID of the flight was MTS56. According to https://www.faa.gov/air_traffic/publications/atpubs/cnt_html/chap3_section_3.html, MTS is the ICAO 3 letters designator for MED JETS, S.A. DE C.V. company, in MEXICO, and its telephony callsign is MEDSERVICE.

Thus this flight callsign was MEDSERVICE 56 (not Med Jets 56 - only Flightaware seem to name it like that, saying that the operator is Med Jets "Mantrust" which is unknown everywhere else)

According to its website, "MED JETS, S.A. DE C.V." (anonym society of variable capital) is doing business as "Jets Rescue" and use the brand "Jets Rescue Air Ambulance" - Jets Rescue Air Ambulance operates in Mexico directly under its own AOC (Air operator's certificate) and indirectly in the US using Century Aviation AOC

If a flight name is used as a title, it should rather be "Jets Rescue Flight 56" than "Med Jets Flight 56" (or 056)

Anyway, according to Naming conventions, since it is NOT a commercial air carrier, and since nobody else than Wikipedia has used Med Jets Flight 56 or any other variant of the flight number, I suggest we "use the "where and what" convention" and revert to the original title "2025 Philadelphia Learjet crash", or to "2025 Medevac Philadelphia Learjet crash" - Df (talk) 16:19, 6 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]

"2025 Philadelphia Learjet crash" makes the most sense to me, but suggest that it gets brought up through WP:RM to gain consensus. - Epluribusunumyall (talk) 01:24, 7 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]
Done - #Requested move 8 February 2025 Df (talk) 19:50, 8 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Filed maximum speed?

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I am a retired aircraft engineer and pilot, and know of no such thing as a filed maximum speed referred to in the article. 184.183.120.187 (talk) 06:10, 7 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Requested move 8 February 2025

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Med Jets Flight 056 → 2025 Philadelphia Learjet crash – Tough "Med Jets SA de CV" is the owner of the aircraft, MTS56 flight (call sign MEDSERVICE 56) was operated under "Jet Rescue Air Ambulance" name, not Med Jets. According to Naming conventions, since it is NOT a commercial air carrier, and since nobody else than Wikipedia (except FlightAware) has used Med Jets Flight 56 or any other variant of the flight number, the requested title (which was the original title) "use the "where and what" convention" - See also #Title and #Med Jets Flight 056 discussions above Df (talk) 19:49, 8 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]

  • Oppose, this is a one plane crash, the 2025 philadelphia learjet crash would make sense if it was a double plane crash. Look at the other one plane crashes, they had the official name for the plane. So that is why I am opposing this. Shaneapickle (talk) 23:54, 8 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose Technically, no, this can still be considered a commercial aircraft as it was registered with a "XA-" prefix which is used by operators intending to carry out commercial use for the aircraft in Mexico (see [3]) and not anything else like "XB-" (private aircraft) or "XC-" (government aircraft). Med Jets Flight 056 also has been in use lately (see [4], [5]). GalacticOrbits (talk) 18:41, 9 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]
    ...in use by people maybe reading wikipedia ;-) ... still waiting a reliable source with that flight designation. And, if we consider a medevac as an Air Carrier flight, we should use the real air carrier name, and the title would rather be "Jet Rescue [air Ambulance] flight [0]56" - no need for 3 digits here, there are flights numbers of 1 to 4 digits, the "0" is not significant - see for instance https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:Aviation_accidents_and_incidents_in_2021Df (talk) 19:35, 9 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]
    I've seen this argument over and over again of removing the leading zero in flight numbers and I most definitely oppose that. The callsign and flight number were MEDSERVICE 056 and MTS056 respectively. FlightRadar confirmed this while FlightAware tends to omit the leading zero in most flight numbers. We have also had a strong precedence on having leading zeroes in flight numbers in the past Korean Air Lines Flight 015, Korean Air Lines Flight 007, Overseas National Airways Flight 032, Mandala Airlines Flight 091, Aeroflot Flight 065, Aeroflot Flight 068, Avianca Flight 011, Avianca Flight 052 just to name a few. It's standard to retain the original flight number and not make up a flight number that "seems more appropriate" than another. The ICAO code MTS belongs to Med Jets so it would be a Med Jets flight and not a Jet Rescue Air Ambulance flight. GalacticOrbits (talk) 03:15, 10 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]
    Well, ICAO code is always 3 digits, the flight number no. We have Qantas Flight 1, Delta Air Lines Flight 89, Meridian Flight 3032 etc... For Flightaware it is MTS56, not 056. For Flightradar24, it's MTS56/MTS056, neither are in their title (see Medevac Learjet 55 crashes near Philadeplphia) and Airline/Operator are "Jet Rescue Air Ambulance" (the name under which "Med Jets, S.A. DE C.V." is doing business)... There is no reliable "original flight number", and it is not up to Wikipedia to invent one. Also, there is a MedJet US-based company without any connection to the crashDf (talk) 15:28, 10 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]
    "ICAO code is always 3 digits": No one's disputing that claim; the ICAO code is always 3 digits long (in this case it's MTS). As I said earlier, FlightAware almost always tends to omit the leading zero for its data while FlightRadar24 keeps it. Qantas Flight 1 isn't Qantas Flight 001 since it was never designated so. It was always designated as QFA1 and not QFA001. Some airlines add (a) leading zero(es) to their flight numbers to make it look more visually appealing, often requiring changes in internal operations. If it's depicted to the public (on the flight information display) with (a) leading zero(es), and is even used internally (as the flight number and the callsign), there is no reason to not use the flight number without them.
    Regarding your claim that the flight number cannot be determined if it was MTS56 or MTS056, it can most definitely be determined with absolute certainty. The callsign of the flight was MEDSERVICE 056 (see: [6]) so that already establishes what the flight number most likely was, but I'll do you one better. The NTSB too reports this to be flight MTS056 and not flight MTS56 (see: [7]). Wikipedia never invents flight numbers (other than the Air Inter Flight 148 exception) and should never invent flight numbers.
    More sources are now using Med Jets Flight 056 as well (see: [8], [9]). This title should stick. GalacticOrbits (talk) 13:22, 11 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]
  • Rename to Jet Rescue Flight MTS056 as it is publicly known as the Jet Rescue crash, and as with the Potomac crash, which is known as the American Eagle crash with the helicopter, this flight is known by its public operating name and not the internal name, just as it is American Eagle and not PSA in the other crash days before -- 65.92.246.77 (talk) 07:18, 10 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]
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