Talk:Bourbon Restoration in France

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Old talk page post

Regarding White Terror: "Although the King and his ministers opposed the violence, they were ineffectual in taking active steps to stop it."

If the King was so opposed, why did he not halt the violence? The logical inference is that he tacitly supported the elimination of his political enemies. To wit, means and opportunity (White Terror) are coupled with motive. Logically, Louis 18 condoned the violence. "The King and his ministers opposed the violence" does read into historical fact (White Terror happened) an assumed state of mind.

Flag of the Kingdom

"Flag of the Kingdom of France (1814-1830)" (National Flag / Naval or Merchant Ensign)
"Royal flag of France during the Bourbon Restoration" (?, same as file Pavillon Louis XIV.png)
"Pavillon royal de France" – Flag of the Royal family of France (wrong, used before the revolution by the Monarchy -- Scu ba)
"Flag of Royalist France" – French Royalists (wrong, used by monarchist forces during the revolution, but not by the restored Bourbons -- Scu ba)

The French article about the flag of France (fr:Drapeau de la France) says explicitely that the de facto national flag of the Kingdom of France was a simple white flag - the lily banner was only used in presence of members of the royal family except the King: When he was present, the white flag had been hoised. To cut a long story short: Please do not insert the lily banner (Pavillon royale de France.svg) anymore, it's the wrong flag here. Louis88 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.169.30.46 (talk) 20:33, 19 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Neutrality & Factuality

Hi. This article is factually inaccurate and contains a non-neutral point of view.

"The ensuing period is called the Restoration, following French usage, and is characterized by a sharp conservative reaction and the re-establishment of the Roman Catholic Church as a power in French politics." (Conservative ??Catholic Power??)

"Louis was forced to grant a written constitution, the Charter of 1814" (forced ??, I don't think so)

"However, the assassination of the Duc de Berry, the ultrareactionary son of Louis's ultrareactionary brother" (Was Berry Ultra-reactionary??)

"Chamber of Deputies ultimately felled the conservative Bourbons." (who? Which member of the family?)

and etc.

(Jack1755 (talk) 13:31, 6 July 2009 (UTC))[reply]

It is a fact that the Restoration was a conservative regime and granted greater political power to the Catholic Church. Berry was an ultrareactionary. And the "conservative Bourbons" refers to the dynasty - Charles X, specifically. Yohan euan o4 (talk) 19:44, 31 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I beg to differ, Sir. -- Jack1755 (talk) 18:48, 8 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Okay...where is it said that it isn't a conservative regime? Yohan euan o4 (talk) 18:31, 9 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

"The period was marked by a constitutional monarchy of moderate rule (1816–20), followed by a return of the ultras during the reign of Louis’ brother, Charles X (1824–30)." -- Brittanica. -- Jack1755 (talk) 11:30, 11 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

This article is horribly skewed with not even a pretense of neutrality. The title should either be changed to "Napoleonic Propaganda," or else, the article needs a complete re-write. As a source of useful information, it is practically worthless. Lorzu (talk) 05:29, 12 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

re: Flag of the Bourbon Restoration

despite what User:Louis88 had said about the White Flag being the Only national Flag of the Kingdom of France during the Restoration... the website of Flags of the World (http://www.fotw.net/flags/fr_rest.html) suggests otherwise; and as a rule i suggest we follow the professionals in the FOTW and not the french wikipedia. --Oren neu dag (talk) 22:53, 26 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Coat of arms of the bourbon restoration

An IP keeps replacing insisting on replacing the Coat of Arms of the Bourbon Restoration (1815-30) with the Grand Royal Coat of Arms of France. I would think the coat of arms of the bourbon restoration is the correct on to use on this page, but I am no expert on heraldry. So what do others think?---- Work permit (talk) 23:07, 10 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Requested move 8 February 2021

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: Moved (non-admin closure) (t · c) buidhe 18:55, 15 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Bourbon Restoration → Bourbon Restoration in France – To distinguish from Bourbon Restoration in Spain. Bourbon Restoration should be a disambiguation page, as it is in French and Spanish Wikipedias ([1] [2]). Vpab15 (talk) 17:43, 8 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Support. Gog the Mild (talk) 18:17, 8 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Support Since there was more than one Bourbon Restoration. Dimadick (talk) 19:00, 8 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Support per WP:NATURALDISAMBIG. And Move Restoration (Spain) to Bourbon Restoration in Spain per WP:NATURALDISAMBIG. Rreagan007 (talk) 19:45, 8 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose. Primary topic. Srnec (talk) 01:54, 12 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Flag

Hello, I changed the flag in the info-box to the pure white flag and this was recently reverted so I'm coming here after looking through the history and seeing a lot of back and forth about the matter. I have come to see if some conscious could be reached on the matter.

Looking through the history the flag seems to have been added first in this edit with the claim that "The plain white flag was almost never used. It usually had a coat of arms in it." However the article itself says: "Symbolic acts such as the replacement of the tricolore flag with the white flag..." and the cited source Tombs, Robert (1996). France 1814–1914. London: Longman. repeatedly talks of the "The Bourbon white flag" for example saying after the restoration that "The tricolour was replaced by the Bourbon white flag." (page 332).

In one of the edit summaries I saw there was a suggestion that we should look to French Wikipedia articles for an answer. Looking at fr:Restauration (histoire de France) they do use the flags but the three sources they give for this flag: [3], [4], [5] are all images showing a pure white flag. fr:Drapeau du royaume de France seems to say that the government during the during the restoration used a plain white flag, with the army using a flag with the royal coat of arms on but the population often used a range of unofficial white flags with different Fleur-de-lis designs on them (see fr:Drapeau du royaume de France#Le drapeau blanc dans la vie publique).

While the white flag might not have been the most popular with the public, I don't see the reason to believe the less official flag we're currently using would have been any more popular.

I think that we should use the pure white flag as it seems to be the flag that the authorities them selves used. Cakelot1 (talk) 00:17, 7 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

83.149.47.224/178.176.230.126, who I assume are the same editor, I want to draw your atention to the above I wrote a couple years ago. Do you think you could provide some reason you want to change the flag, as it isn't supported by the sources as far as I can see. Cakelot1 ☞️ talk 21:34, 17 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Flag change request

There are two types of papers that can be used as evidence:

One is a paper and the other is French Wikipedia.

There is also controversy. --211.197.54.36 (talk) 08:34, 4 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

The first is an image which explicitly shows a plain white flag on top of the building (which is already used in the article [in the note next to flag] as an example of the all white flag being used), and the second is a fr Wikipedia (WP:RSPWP) which was changed only 2 months ago without comment. Neither of these sources is reliable and, one actively shows the opposite of what you claim. See also, the section above this where I explain my thoughts on the topic more. Cakelot1 ☞️ talk 18:37, 4 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]