Talk:Puszta

Merge Puszta with Pannonian steppe

Please don’t change this. I have just looked up Puszta as I came across the word in a book and it was so-o useful to find this article ixo (talk) 21:01, 22 January 2022 (UTC)

Puszta is Hungarian name for steppe with official name Pannonian (Pannonic) steppe. Its not only in Hungary (but probably more than 90% of steppe is there, and in Hungary is known as Puszta) and Burgenland but also in Slovakia and Serbia. Main biom is Pannonian steppe and some special kinds of Pannonian steppes are called Puszta, for example Hortobagy puszta or Grassy saline pusta [1]. It exist scholar publications which call this steppe Pannonic or Pannonian: [2], [3], [4], [5]. Here you can see[6] some pictures of Pannonian steppe in south Slovakia with name Čenkovská step (steppe), in the picture its table written in Slovak and Hungarian and word Puszta means Steppe. So we have article about Hungarian word Steppe, according to [WP:EN] article should be renamed to English name. Term Puszta is vague and it can be used figuratively for a 1) traditional Hungarian landscape, 2) for Hortobagy puszta and next meanings can be: 3) just a Steppe in Hungarian and 4) grasslands in Hungary 5) not scholar name for Pannonian steppe. --Samofi (talk) 16:02, 23 February 2012 (UTC)

Whatever "Pannonian steppe" is, it must be something different thing.

When you talk, you should wait for others to react, until it, it's not really a conversation.

"So we have article about Hungarian word Steppe" The exact Hungarian word for it "alföld" (and there is an article for it) not puszta.

"alföld" is "lowland", "puszta" is "plain", "sztyeppe" is "steppe" and they means something similar in English too - Csendesmark (talk) 02:53, 4 April 2012 (UTC)

Hello, thank you for blaming of me. It was a merger proposal here and nobody reacted more than 2 weeks. I understand you hardly but I will try to answer. Do you think that Pannoian steppe is something different than Puszta? So why its Hortobagy puszta traslated as Hortobagy steppe in academical sources? We have almost 400 searches at google.books: [7]. Here you can see that Hortobagy is the part of Pannonian steppe: [8]. Puszta is used mostly in Hungarian sources or in the English unscholar sources such a travel guides and so on.. Its one grassland, same in the Hungary, Austria, Serbia, Slovakia but only in Hungary its name is Puszta. Probably you did not read WP:MERGE. This can be also useful if you have a time for a study: WP:NOTDICDEF , WP:AT. And this is English Wikipedia, steppe is translated as puszta form English: http://szotar.sztaki.hu/dict_search.php?L=ENG%3AHUN%3AEngHunDict&O=ENG&flash=&E=1&sid=4607b8950342c6efa1e6a40cbbc5b70a&vk=&in_form=1&W=steppe&M=1&P=0&C=1&T=1 --Samofi (talk) 16:03, 8 April 2012 (UTC)

Hello! I am not blaming you, but no reason to rush. :) I looked deeper into this topic, and I did not find many other things over your article on English-Wikipedia with Google or other sources. But I found the English name of what we talking about, where we should merge both articles. It's here Carpathian Basin, and backed up with some background :)

I also failed to found this "designation" you calling it on other Wikipedia articles, if it's so obvious, why nobody else using it? But seriously? -Csendesmark (talk) 08:52, 9 April 2012 (UTC)

Carpathian basin is redirected to Pannonian basin. Pannonian basin is morpho-geographical unit see Geomorphology, Puszta or Pannonian steppe is same biogeographical unit - biome. Its 2 different things biom and morphogeographical unit. :) --Samofi (talk) 20:18, 9 April 2012 (UTC)

I will cite from Tomas Kamusella: "The Magyars were the steppe pastoralists, who established themselves in the puszta (from Slavic pusty meaning 'empty land'), or the Pannonian steppe. "--Samofi (talk) 11:56, 12 April 2012 (UTC)

If the two designate the same thing, Pannonian steppe should be merged into this article, not vice-versa. We have 162 Google Books results for "Pannonian steppe" and 223,000 Google Books results for "Puszta" (for English pages). Bzg1920 (talk) 12:12, 12 April 2012 (UTC)

Javorniky vs Mapple mountains. 1380 English hits for Javorniky [9] and 3 hits about Maple Mountains in Carpathians [10] you moved article because of WP:EN to Maple Mountains. Is this a different case? --Samofi (talk) 13:05, 12 April 2012 (UTC)

Good analogy. I guess I was wrong when I moved Javorniky. In fact Mont Blanc means "White Mountain" too, but the article is titled after the French name Bzg1920 (talk) 14:23, 12 April 2012 (UTC)

And this is a specific case, coz biogeographical or botanical articles written by specialists (WP:IRS) use term Pannonian or Pannonic steppe. English travel guides and popular literature use Puszta. Puszta is also used as synonym for Hungarian grassy landscape, or for Hortobagy (Hortobagy is offten called The Puszta). Term Puszta is not precisely deffined. So is it better to use a common name or scholar name? Probably 95% of Pannonian steppe (Puszta) is in Hungary, but why it should be used term "Puszta" for a whole steppe biom? Same case like Little Carpathians and Male Karpaty or White Carpathians and Biele Karpaty. In all these cases is more searches in they native names - in English language too. Puszta is great example of word which should be mentioned in Wictionary: http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/pusta#English There its defined like Hungarian steppe. Only steppe in Central europe is Pannonian steppe, so Puszta is the Hungarian name for Pannonian steppe. It says my logic. --Samofi (talk) 14:46, 12 April 2012 (UTC)

If you say Puszta is the same with the Pannonian Steppe, I suggest you to initiate a WP:RM process. These kind of article renaming discussions usually attract third-party editors too Bzg1920 (talk) 14:52, 12 April 2012 (UTC)

I didn't found what you quoted, can you give me an other link? Csendesmark (talk) 19:04, 27 April 2012 (UTC)